[MovingIn07]

Originally Posted by gilleshk

Islam prohibits the drinking of alcohol yet many muslim drink. It's not a stereotype to say that muslims don't or shouldn't drink, it's a part of the religion and one may choose to paint those who are drinking as untrue to their faith

Your nationality or your ethnicity isn't a choice.

Actually that's not true. It's a crime in some Muslim countries to "not" be a muslim if you are born to be one (even in a reasonably sensible place like Malaysia).

[MovingIn07]

Back to the OP's original problem - I don't think it's an "american" trait to get loud when frustrated etc, but it is quite "western" I think to feel it's ok to say so out loud. He probably has no idea how he comes across because he's used to being able to speak his mind - you might want to just quietly have a word and say his behaviour is difficult for you to deal with and could he tone it down.

I behave similarly sometimes - if frustrated with HSBC (and you've read some of my posts on here!) I get cross with them on the phone etc and have to remember that the other people in the office don't really want to listen to me ranting out loud! Luckily I have western co-workers as well as hk-co-workers and the western ones are pretty quick to tell me to shut up!

[KnowItAll]

XI_YAN : The Ugly American - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia and Ugly American - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Skyhook]

Kia has inspired a good idea that should make sauvignon88's angry American work colleague, feel a little self conscious, for a spell.

Sauvignon88,
go out and buy a Hawaiian shirt and a copy of the book "The Ugly American ", arrive to work an hour earlier than usual, or before other staff members, place the neatly folded shirt on agro Americans desk, with the book placed on top. Then, leave the office, go and grab a coffee, arrive later, at your routine work time, and see if agro American behaves any differently. Chances are, he will either FLIP out in rage, or, he might get the hint, that the office has had enough of his BS.

If you are worried about being detected by CCTV, you might want to organise a delivery boy/girl, to drop off a package to the office, with the Hawaiian shirt & book inside, that he needs to sign for, anonymously.

As Lammarite put it, its time to HTFU...

Amuse-toi bien, et bonne chance ... sauvignon88 .

[MovingIn07]

I disagree - although am entertained by the humour! One of the good things about americans is that they appreciate straight talking. So just TELL him how you feel! This is all he is doing to you - telling you (and the rest of the office by the sounds of it) how he feels and does not realise (probably) that it's upsetting folks. If he has not been outside the US before he may not realise that other cultures do not appreciate such behaviour and while it's not easy to change, it helps if you know you need to try!

[MovingIn07]

Of course, if you want to be even clearer with your "subtle" approach, a copy of this thread on top of the book might help!!

[gilleshk]

Originally Posted by MovingIn07

Actually that's not true. It's a crime in some Muslim countries to "not" be a muslim if you are born to be one (even in a reasonably sensible place like Malaysia).

What exactly isn't true? It's exactly the same as being a communist, you may follow the crowd but if you don't believe, what you do in private is your own thing. Some muslim drink alcohol in every country in the privacy of their own even when it's not allowed outside. Your thoughts are your own wherever you are but it's pretty hard to change the color of your skin.

[gilleshk]

Originally Posted by MovingIn07

I disagree - although am entertained by the humour! One of the good things about americans is that they appreciate straight talking. So just TELL him how you feel! This is all he is doing to you - telling you (and the rest of the office by the sounds of it) how he feels and does not realise (probably) that it's upsetting folks. If he has not been outside the US before he may not realise that other cultures do not appreciate such behaviour and while it's not easy to change, it helps if you know you need to try!

Sure in America, everyone appreciates being rude, loud and obnoxious!

Keep in mind that if has a chip on his shoulder which has nothing to do with being american, he might simply tell you to f-off and mind your own business and make your life even more miserable.

A wiser approach might be to go through someone he may like or be friends with or at the last resort his supervisor. My personal approach is to simply ignore jerks and use maximal avoidance because I don't believe a leopard changes his spots. Only as a very last resort will I tell them in their face that I can't stand them and they should stay away from me but I have done it on a few occasions and it was effective.

[Sleuth]

Originally Posted by hullexile

Oh and culturally speaking, Americans are defined as individualistic so would want everything to go their way, whereas in more collectivist cultures there would be a willingness to sacrifice personal wants for the good of the group (e.g. family).

Okay on your first post, there are different degrees and the second one hadn't occured to me. But it does exist.
And we are individualistic. But I would say it is more not performing personal sacrifice for the good of the community/state/goverment. Not family; plenty of Americans sacrifice for their family.

[hullexile]

Originally Posted by Sleuth

Okay on your first post, there are different degrees and the second one hadn't occured to me. But it does exist.
And we are individualistic. But I would say it is more not performing personal sacrifice for the good of the community/state/goverment. Not family; plenty of Americans sacrifice for their family.

Yes agreed, but again there are degrees. Many of the working girls in Wan Chai are doing it for their families - not sure many western girls would go that far. Also 'the family' extends out to 4th cousins, umpteen times removed. Certainly not the case in the UK. I accept though that this is not all cultural, it also relates to the lack of welfare support available.