[emmie]

The term "FOB" seems a little airy-fairy to me, and may depend on the context.

Over the years, I've mixed with many native HK-ers, and, courtesy of them and their introducing me to local culture/ways, managed, somewhat, to "straighten out" most of my spoken Cantonese, to "blend" a bit more into HK life here. It's way easier as I'm ethnic Chinese though born/raised elsewhere "West"; nevertheless, I'm still sorta a "FOB" in their eyes - BUT nothing really strange 'bout that.

The "tension" or "split" detected by Dean, from his perspective... well, guess I wasn't alert enuff to them (?). Odd, but intriguing thread topic.

[Skyhook]

Deano,

I can understand that us Aussies have a soft spot for Hong Kong. We certainly contributed in our own way, aviation being the most obvious area, with the co founding of Cathay Pacific in 1946. Maybe you didnt know that. An Aussie pilot not much older than you Dean, co founded his first airline with the help of an American pilot, and his American venture capitalist..

Not to mention the many Aussies that were here during the early years of the Kai Tak Airport, a tiny little outpost back then. You'll find a lot of history if you bothered to research this once Commonwealth territory. Or do you just ignore anything that was contributed by other than HK Chinese prior to 1997 ?

I like Hong Kong, I love France and Italy, I am a new Zealand Citizen by fathers nationality as well, I respect the United Kingdom, but no location other than Australia ie Melbourne is my birth hometown.

What ever floats your boat Dean... I still think you are confused about this whole topic.

Its all a bit weird, as we all do our bit to making this city what it is, as we have always done. It's all based on accumulation of shared talent, locally and internationally. New people arrive here all the time, and luckilly as a joint expat community we all do our best to pool together. Making our lives easier in a foreign land, not that Hong kong is all that foreign, thanks to obvious British infrastructural traits. Like street signage, public transport and a rule of law, a constitution that was penned in English etc etc etc.

Imagine if we never existed here, and HK was left untouched by international influence, never leased to the British for 100 years... What are the chances that this city would be just another Shenzhen ?

It certainly wouldnt appear to be anything like what we enjoy now, the Tsing ma bridge wouldnt exist, nor would Chek Lap Kok airport.

Anyway its been an interesting debate as such, if not a tad, off beat.

[Crocodile]

Okay, so I have been reading this forum topic with a little bit of interest and amusement. I am not really sure what it is all meant to be about. It is a topic that has started from a Wiki definition - yep, always my Number 1 source of what is correct in the world. Wiki is full of definitions/descriptions that have a "slant" one way or another. Never totally wrong, but it is hardly academic.

Now a YouTube video is meant to explain more? What makes you think that this "Australian" woman has not been in Hong Kong for a large majority of her life? Just because she is white? Listen to her pronunciation - it is not Australian, it is 100% Hong Kong (I am no expert, but even I know when someone has a accent). With a little investigating I am sure you would find the true answer.

Just because it is on the internet, doesn't make it true. (Expelled, anyone?!)

This whole topic has made me ask: "What's All That About?"

YouTube - The Late Show: What's All That About

[Skyhook]

Ha Ha Ha thats gold ! The late Show ! Mich Malloy and co. That was great...

[dean-dzai]

Originally Posted by Crocodile

Now a YouTube video is meant to explain more? What makes you think that this "Australian" woman has not been in Hong Kong for a large majority of her life? Just because she is white? Listen to her pronunciation - it is not Australian, it is 100% Hong Kong (I am no expert, but even I know when someone has a accent). With a little investigating I am sure you would find the true answer.

Exactly, if she did sound a little Australian she would be 'more' FOB. It is largely irrelevant how long it took her to reach her level, it's that she did reach the level. Her Cantonese is not perfect either, but it is very very impressive. The more it can be noted that we are not 'from here' the more FOB it can be said that we are. Yes, it goes against National pride of land of origin - if you don't like that it's okay, don't do it.

I have spoken to foreigners who achieve very high levels of Cantonese proficiency in relatively short periods of time. The way they do this many of you I know would call radical. For instance avoiding talking English to anyone at all (avoiding most of us including myself because my Cantonese level is not good for more then a few minutes).

In all this I would say there is no right or wrong. Personally I think the point to note is all our differing views on other foreigners choices regarding reaching cultural and linguistic proficiency and whatever it takes to reach it (sometimes positive, sometimes critical).

Originally Posted by Skyhook

What ever floats your boat Dean... I still think you are confused about this whole topic.

Which topic? The Wikipedia article is the topic, I started the topic. I'm telling you 'what I think', I'm not telling you 'what to think'. So it's only as valid or invalid as you want it to be.