[goleoboy]

Originally Posted by emmie

JGL - Your above expresses my thoughts, exactly.

Been almost branded "a traitor" to my face in the midst of HEATED "opinion sharing" with a particular PATRIOTIC local... Apparently, my ethnic Chinese-ness was "lost" because I was born and brought up in, so was "seduced" by all things "West".

It's strange how SOME immediately BRISTLE at ANY objection to the (often authoritarian) line taken by the Beijing central government. As IF to say anything to "offend" the communist ruling party is to "offend" ALL Chinese people ("all over the world", blah...).

In the West, we can openly criticise / bash the policies of Bush, and previously Blair etc, without their public whinging about the "hurt feelings" of ALL their respective peoples...

Yeah, government policy and "the people" aren't always on the same page.

yes in the west you can openly criticise the central govt - a concept that will take china a while to embrace. but the western media has always been able to sway public opinion - that's probably why there aren't large protests against the Guantanamo Bay issues... because the media gives it zero coverage here. i'm the same as you, chinese but grew up and supposedly brainwashed by the 'west' - and when i moved back to HK and was exposed to various perspectives other than CNN and MSNBC and other mainstream u.s. news, I saw just how little was actually reported to the american public. it's interesting, was watching news in NY yesterday and they were trying to interview a pro-china rally attendee but when the person tried to answer, it was edited short and back to the anchors... the editing was so sloppy and obvious, it was a joke...

To think that the majority of the public out there can honestly distinguish the 'gov' vs. 'the people' one must be living in lalaland... if that's the case, japanese internment camps would not have existed during WWII, comments like 'those selfish greedy chinese wanting to own the world' wouldn't come up on blogs and comments on sites like ny times.com...

[beachgirl]

Its never an issue of open critics towards China, openly critics towards China has never been stopped !! Such as safety issues of Chinese Manufacturing products, and response from government has been keen as I remembered. But its about bias of Western Media. CNN has been singled out for using a photograph in March on its website that cropped out t¡betan rioters attacking Chinese targets, focusing instead on a Chinese military vehicle. Last week passions flared when CNN commentator Jack Cafferty described China's leaders as a 'bunch of goons and thugs'. I could not see any professionals whatsoever, which indeed turned the people of china to be extremely supportive and patriotic towards the current chinese govenement.

[beachgirl]

• A POEM FOR THE WEST - Author unknown -

When We were called Sick man of Asia, We were called The Peril.
When We are billed to be the next Superpower, We are called The threat.

When We were closed our doors, You smuggled Drugs to Open Markets.
When We Embrace Freed Trade, You blame us for Taking away your jobs.
??
When We were falling apart, You marched in your troops and wanted your "fair share".
When We were putting the broken peices together again, "Free t¡bet" you screamed, "it was an invasion!"
( When Woodrow Wilson Couldn't give back Birth Place of Confucius back to Us,
But He did bought a ticket for the Famine Relief Ball for us.)
??
So, We Tried Communism, You hated us for being Communists
When We embrace Capitalism, You hate us for being Capitalist.
?
When We have a Billion People, you said we were destroying the planet.
When We are tried limited our numbers, you said It was human rights abuse.

When We were Poor, You think we are dogs.
When We Loan you cash, You blame us for your debts.
??
When We build our industries, You called us Polluters.
When we sell you goods, You blame us for global warming.
??
When We buy oil, You called that exploitation and Genocide.
When You fight for oil, You called that Liberation.
??
When We were lost in Chaos and rampage, You wanted Rules of Law for us.
When We uphold law and order against Violence, You called that Violating Human Rights.

When We were silent, You said you want us to have Free Speech.
When We were silent no more, You say we were Brainwashed-Xenophoics.
??
Why do you hate us so much? We asked.
"No," You Answered, "We don't hate You."
??
We don't Hate You either,
But Do you understand us?
??
"Of course We do," You said,
"We have AFP, CNN and BBCs..."
??
What do you really want from us?
Think Hard first, then Answer...
??
Because you only get so many chances,
Enough is Enough, Enough Hypocrisy for this one world.
??
We want One World, One Dream, And Peace On Earth.
- This Big Blue Earth is Big Enough for all of Us.

[KnowItAll]

Wow .. the PR corps are out in full force.

[Lammarite]

The Dalai Lama could have a great career in PR or Marketing too.

[emmie]

Originally Posted by Lammarite

The Dalai Lama could have a great career in PR or Marketing too.

A totally FAIR comment.

Politics and diplomatics and wranglings behind the scenes... with some "unfortunate" consequences. Yeah, all this tiresome "them & us"...

I wouldn't dare presume to know enough about these "complex" issues (who does?); so better say no more, and let 'em all VENT and "rumble" it out here, IF that's what floats their boat

[beachgirl]

Originally Posted by beachgirl

Its never an issue of open critics towards China, openly critics towards China has never been stopped !! Such as safety issues of Chinese Manufacturing products, and response from government has been keen as I remembered. But its about bias of Western Media. CNN has been singled out for using a photograph in March on its website that cropped out t¡betan rioters attacking Chinese targets, focusing instead on a Chinese military vehicle. Last week passions flared when CNN commentator Jack Cafferty described China's leaders as a 'bunch of goons and thugs'. I could not see any professionals whatsoever, which indeed turned the people of china to be extremely supportive and patriotic towards the current chinese govenement.

Acutually, I should be very careful when refer to Chinese and t¡betans.

When refer to Chinese here, the meaning should not limited to Han only, Chinese are made of 56 majorities and minorities, when many of you refer to Chinese here, you refer to Han Chinese, that auto separated Chinese into your idea of singling.

t¡betans is not limited to t¡betan exiles and splitter and DL only, t¡betan is some what 2.5 millions now living in t¡bet, if you speak of the right of t¡betans, you speak of 2.5 millions, not those less than 0.5% that funded by CIA and western manipulative politicians.

The fundamental injustice here is the riots under the name of freedom, killing innocent Han, Hui(Islamic Chinese), t¡betans, burning down house, attacking schools, severe violence towards commonalty regardless whatever ethics they belong to in Lhasa, is not going to be tolerated by any governments especially the westerns, surprisely, the bias in western media, no detail report of any of these violence but back them up under the name of freedom and human rights, and change the story into Chinese government crack down of uprisings is a huge lie. Which has made the western media lost its credibility to the Chinese people, big time. And this has never happen before. In general, most Chinese respect Western media as they always claim to be fair, justice and reliable. I believe this is the very first time, that Western media did not realize that how much damage that they have done to their own selves only to provoke 1.3 b Chinese (not limited to Han Chinese) that is 1/4 of world population.

[Football16]

I struggled with the title of this thread when I first read it as I didn't think it was a fair comment and definitely don't think it fair based on the attacks of the torch bearers in numerous nations.

Being old enough to remember the 1960s- early '70s as a moderate student leader at Simon Fraser University surrounded by campus radicals, I know first-hand how misguided people are who protest by hindering other people's rights.

The protesters will attack the torch bearers as they believe the ends justifies the means. Correction: these morons know the media of the world will give them coverage so that is what this is about. It doesn't matter what the issue is, this is what they seek - media attention.

The irony of ironies is that these clowns have no idea what human rights and freedoms are about and if they did, they'd protest without taking the rights and freedoms to watch an event without fear of it being disrupted.

Make no mistake these protesters would be the first to take away our freedoms if given the chance. The good news, if my experience in the early 70s is any judge, these guys eventually grow up to be responsible citizens who themselves decry the new generation. Go figure.

I know that one of the downsides to holding Olympic Games is the high cost of security and post 911, even moreso. Having guards for the torch makes sense and there is always tension in countries when visiting dignitaries arrive with their body guards and it will go on for our life times and beyond. Why would the torch guards differ?

[climber07]

Originally Posted by beachgirl

When We uphold law and order against Violence, You called that Violating Human Rights.

Yep.....order restored!!! .... Nice work. Those students were nothing but violent thugs.

[PDLM]

Originally Posted by beachgirl

the bias in western media, no detail report of any of these violence but back them up under the name of freedom and human rights, and change the story into Chinese government crack down of uprisings is a huge lie. Which has made the western media lost its credibility to the Chinese people, big time.

The fundamental point that you seem to be missing is that the Chinese Government refused access to the media. If the Government was so sure of the rightness of its case then surely the sensible thing to do would be to allow the media free access to see for themselves? The fact that the Chinese Government's knee-jerk reaction is to hide everything and control information to the greatest extent possible (even when this does major harm to their image in the rest of the world) is the biggest barrier to better mutual understanding here.

In truly free and open societies the government does not restrict the people's access to the media: it puts its case through the media and allows the people to see for themselves who is right.