[freeier]

the rifle industry lobbyist are one of the most famous in the united states.

i think it has gone too far. i doubt they can do anything now that the streets are full of guns

[sylvesterjay]

he did plan it, he knew he needed to wait 30 days to get his second gun, which after obtaining it he went on his rampage

[Krad]

Never underestimate the power of the NRA spin doctors and lobbyists. Cases like this are meat and potatoes for them to try and get conceal and carry laws pushed through Congress.

The whole problem really, is that even though the 2nd amendment was meant to preserve the rights to form a militia, it wasn't worded that way. By simply saying that citizens "have the right to bear arms", they've enabled lawmakers and politicians to twist and bend the definitions beyond recognition.

As for the tape, I don't believe that the media is being irresponsible for releasing the tape. I do think that they're irresponsible for only showing pieces of the tape. In my opinion, the entire tape should be released to the public, put on Youtube, and opened up for everyone to see, review, and criticize. This is a rare opportunity for people to see how the mind of a madman works. Maybe by seeing the signs, understanding to a point what is going on in this kid's head, we can spot, prevent, and help the next potential killer, instead of waiting until it's too late.

[sunniefaith]

How did the Virginia killer fall through the cracks?

http://www.todayonline.com/articles/184251.asp

I read this with interest. The gun man obviously had issues and people knew that he had issues. How did he fall through the cracks? He could have been helped. I've never lived in the States and therefore I can't say anything about their politics. Just wondering if the americans are proud that they have freedom to own and carry guns? Is this the formula for democracy for americans? Democracy = Freedom = Freedom of guns?

[greenietea]

When the Bill of Rights was drafted, the intention of the second amendment was for the citizens to bear arms to rebel against an unjust government. Having said that, I don't understand why Bush is still alive.

On the other hand, in response to your question about the media broadcasting the videos, I think they are definitely very disturbing and hurtful, especially to the victims and their families. Fact that it gave out no better reason other than he was insane was what bothered me most. I don't think they should be airing it constantly on the news. But they should be make them available for those who are actually interested.

To add to this thread, there are many discussions in the Asian American community regarding the killer's ethnicity and the fear for backlash against Koreans. I'm not sure how people feel about this, but I'm just glad the shooter wasn't of Middle Eastern origin. :T

[Sleuth]

Originally Posted by Krad

The whole problem really, is that even though the 2nd amendment was meant to preserve the rights to form a militia, it wasn't worded that way. By simply saying that citizens "have the right to bear arms", they've enabled lawmakers and politicians to twist and bend the definitions beyond recognition.

Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.


I disagree. The Second Amendent was stated correctly and wasn't meant to preserve the right to form militias. It was meant to make sure that able-bodied men had guns and could report to a militia. That way the central government was not the only institution with arms. And I am not sure how the current politicians and lawmakers have bent the original meaning; the meaning is rather plain and to te point. Which is why politicians have not been abe to twist it.

And, just for the record, I do not own guns, do not want to own guns and question the sanity of those that do. America does not need more guns, but you can't take the away, you can only tighten the restrictions on owning and those restrictons have to be reasonable.

[sunniefaith]

Guns can protect and at the same time kill...Maybe I'm just naive or maybe I was brought up in a country that guns are definitely not a norm. But I believe that this is what you get with freedom of guns. This is not the first and definitely not the last of suching killings. Isn't this worse than terrorism?

[Choccywoccydoodah]

First I would like to say as an American that we shouldn't be quick to generalize that ALL Americans are adamant about their 2nd amendedment rights to own/carry a firearm. (as has been pointed out several times on this thread the right technically does not exist in the wording of the document - and can only be inferred if you remove the whole bit about 'a well regulated militia for the protection of the state') Anyways, I found this very interesting article after reading the posts here that I thought I would share:

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcgvinco.html

It basically shows a definite correlation between countries which have strict gun control laws (unlike the US) and the rate of homicides. Now personally I don't think Americans are naturally more homicidal than any other country - guns are the major problem. Unfortunately, it will be difficult - if not impossible to convince millions of people that they should give up the 'right' to own one...very sad as we can all see what it leads to.

[Sleuth]

Originally Posted by Choccywoccydoodah

(as has been pointed out several times on this thread the right technically does not exist in the wording of the document - and can only be inferred if you remove the whole bit about 'a well regulated militia for the protection of the state')

Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.


The right does exist. It quite plainy states the people have a right to keep and bear arms. What it also plainly does not say is that the right is somehow based on joining a miitia.
Are you asserting that (1) only militia men can keep an bear arms or (2) that arms can only be kept and beared when servng in a militia?
In both 1795 and 1804 people of the 1776 generation went back and added some amendents (11 and 12); they did not change #2.
In America in the 1700s and 1800s, I believe it would have been inconceivable to the Founders to outlaw guns. They were used all over the frontier and not just to commit crimes. Plus a lot of these people had fled Britain/Europe where they feared persecution and having a gun to deter overly-aggressive policing was probaby a good idea to them.

[Sleuth]

Greenietea--George W. Bush is still alive because it would be illegal to kill a President and he wl be gone in 2008. If you can't wait until 2008 and think the best course of acton in the US is either assination or rebellion, feel free to go purchase guns in the US and perform either action.
Sunniefaith--No, this is not worse than terrorism, it is the same. All homicide is equal.
Bli--Or should I call you "John Kerry"? The US military is not a small, disadvantaged minority. And the rest of the US is not iving it up. Several million people are agonized over this war and are trying to bring the troops home.